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Andrew Huberman · 2023-06-12

The Science of MDMA & Its Therapeutic Uses: Benefits & Risks | Huberman Lab Podcast

Huberman breaks down how MDMA's dual dopamine-and-serotonin surge makes it a uniquely effective empathogen for augmenting PTSD talk therapy.

The Science of MDMA & Its Therapeutic Uses: Benefits & Risks | Huberman Lab Podcast
The guest

Andrew Huberman: Professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine and host of the Huberman Lab podcast. This is a solo episode.

What this episode covers

Andrew Huberman delivers a solo deep-dive on MDMA (ecstasy), explaining its unusual chemistry as a synthetic compound that powerfully raises both dopamine and serotonin, acting as an empathogen rather than a classic psychedelic. He walks through how MDMA reduces amygdala-insula threat connectivity, why this makes it valuable for PTSD, and how its effects differ from psilocybin, LSD, and ketamine. He carefully examines the neurotoxicity debate, including a retracted Science paper, the role of caffeine, body temperature, and fentanyl contamination of street supply. He closes with the MAPS Phase 3 clinical trial results showing MDMA-assisted therapy achieving roughly 88% clinical response and 67% PTSD remission, far exceeding talk therapy plus placebo.

Recommended on this episode

BookRecommendedISBN verified

Trauma: The Invisible Epidemic

Paul Conti

“I highly recommend the book trauma”
“if any of you are interested in trauma and its treatment I highly recommend the book trauma by Dr Paul Conte he's an MD medical doctor psychiatrist”— Andrew Huberman

Also referenced (named, not recommended)

BookReferenced

PIHKAL: A Chemical Love Story

Alexander Shulgin

“there's a wonderful book called pikal that stands for p-i-k-h-a-l p call is the title of the book which Shogun wrote which describes his discovery of MDMA”— Andrew Huberman
BookReferencedISBN verified

The Body Keeps the Score

Bessel van der Kolk

“many people have perhaps heard of the book the body keeps the score which is a very successful and popular book about the idea that trauma can be quote unquote stored in the body”— Andrew Huberman
ProductReferenced

Adderall

Teva Pharmaceuticals

“I discussed the biology and mechanisms of drugs like Adderall and Vyvanse which basically are either combinations of amphetamines or single types of amphetamines”— Andrew Huberman
ProductReferenced

Vyvanse

Takeda Pharmaceuticals

“I discussed the biology and mechanisms of drugs like Adderall and Vyvanse which basically are either combinations of amphetamines or single types of amphetamines”— Andrew Huberman
ProductReferenced

Prozac

Eli Lilly

“the ssris The Selective serotonin reuptake Inhibitors ssris such as fluoxetine Prozac as well as Zoloft and of course there are many other accessories”— Andrew Huberman
ProductReferenced

Zoloft

Pfizer

“the ssris The Selective serotonin reuptake Inhibitors ssris such as fluoxetine Prozac as well as Zoloft and of course there are many other accessories out there”— Andrew Huberman

Big reveals from this episode

  • MDMA was first synthesized by drug company Merck in the early 1900s but was never applied to a clinical use until rediscovered by chemist Alexander Shulgin.
  • MDMA raises serotonin at least three times and maybe up to eight times more than it raises dopamine, an unusual combination unique among compounds.
  • Unlike psilocybin and LSD which act on the serotonin 2A receptor, MDMA largely acts on the serotonin 1B receptor, explaining its distinct pro-social effects.
  • Despite huge oxytocin increases from MDMA, the data show oxytocin is NOT the source of its pro-social effects.
  • The famous 2002 Science paper claiming MDMA causes severe primate neurotoxicity was retracted; the monkeys were accidentally given methamphetamine, not MDMA.
  • MDMA-assisted therapy achieved an 88% clinically effective response versus 60% for therapy plus placebo, with 67% no longer meeting PTSD criteria.
  • Internet 5-HTP/L-tryptophan/L-tyrosine 'crash' protocols are likely useless or even detrimental; the crash is better explained by a rise in prolactin.

Worth remembering

  • MDMA is a purely synthetic compound that, as far as we know, does not exist anywhere in nature, unlike mescaline, LSD precursors, or psilocybin.
  • A Johns Hopkins study found octopuses given MDMA spend more time socializing, and their serotonin transporter shares homology with humans'.
  • Typical study dosages of MDMA range from 0.75 to 1.5 milligrams per kilogram of body weight.
  • MDMA at 1.5 mg/kg raised circulating oxytocin nearly five-fold, from 18.6 to 83.7 picograms per milliliter.
  • Even a single dose of methamphetamine can be neurotoxic, and combining caffeine with amphetamines or MDMA increases that neurotoxicity.
  • An increase of just three or four degrees in body temperature can start to kill neurons, making hot rave environments a real neurotoxicity risk.
  • An estimated 60 to 80 percent of gray-market drugs are repackaged with deadly fentanyl, making street MDMA sourcing extremely dangerous.
  • As many as eight percent of people in the United States have PTSD, with high comorbidity rates for addiction and depression.
  • About half of people who do talk therapy alone for PTSD achieve no long-lasting relief of symptoms.