James Sexton: A New York divorce trial attorney with over two decades litigating high-conflict divorces and custody cases. He is the author of 'How to Stay in Love: A Divorce Lawyer's Guide to Staying Together' and a brown belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu under Marcelo Garcia.
What this episode covers
Lex Fridman and divorce lawyer James Sexton trade stories and philosophy about why relationships fall apart and how they can last. Sexton argues that marriages fail not from one big event but from slow 'disconnection' built out of neglected small gestures, and that the antidote is presence, fearless communication, and choosing to adore your partner. The conversation ranges across infidelity, prenups, the cost and mechanics of divorce, weaponizing children in custody fights, and how high-net-worth and celebrity divorces are ultimately driven by the same petty insecurities as everyone else's. Sexton repeatedly frames love as a worthwhile bet despite its certainty of ending in death or divorce, drawing analogies from Jiu-Jitsu, dogs, hospice work, and his own amicable divorce. He closes with a speculative idea about using psychedelics to do transformative divorce mediation.
Recommended on this episode
Rick and Morty
Justin Roiland and Dan Harmon
“it's why like Rick and Morty I think is brilliant because it's both smart and dumb yeah it's a perfect combination it really is yeah it's I think it's possibly the perfect show”— James Sexton
Yellowstone
Taylor Sheridan
“by the way Yellowstone's just so great oh it's so good right”— Lex Fridman
The guest's own work
How to Stay in Love: A Divorce Lawyer's Guide to Staying Together
James Sexton
“you mentioned infidelity you write in the book which everybody should get it's a great book it's a great read it's a window into your soul”— James Sexton
Also referenced (named, not recommended)
True Romance
Tony Scott
“there's a scene in the movie True Romance yeah because I love a great movie I mean that Gary Oldman seems like the greatest scene ever done in in film”— James Sexton
BoJack Horseman
Raphael Bob-Waksberg
“let me quote BoJack Horseman on this when you look at someone through Rose Colored Glasses all the red flags just look like Flags that's great”— Lex Fridman
Drugstore Cowboy
Gus Van Sant
“there's a line in the drugstore cowboy which is a great film where he says we played a game you couldn't win to the utmost”— James Sexton
The Town
Ben Affleck
“the Ben Affleck movie The Town you know that scene that's friendship to me I mean to me the ideal male friendship is the scene”— James Sexton
8 Mile
Curtis Hanson
“we did it like at the end like Eminem at the end of eight mile like it was very like yeah I cheated on her with this person”— James Sexton
Annie Hall
Woody Allen
“I think it's Annie Hall it's one of the Woody Allen films where Diane Keaton and Woody Allen are both talking to their respective therapists”— James Sexton
The Wall
Pink Floyd
“I think it's the whole Arc of Pink Floyd The Wall it's literally the entire Arc of Pink Floyd The Wall”— James Sexton
Big reveals from this episode
- Sexton's core thesis: marriages fail from slow 'disconnection,' not single events like cheating; cheating is the 'all at once' symptom of a slow decline.
- Describes himself as 'empath in the sheets, sociopath in the streets' a courtroom weapon for clients but candid and emotionally attuned behind closed doors.
- Reveals his firm's 'Eight Mile strategy' having a client openly own their worst texts/affairs on the stand to neutralize the opposing lawyer's attack.
- Confirms his book chapter title 'everybody fucks the nanny' and shares a case where the wife and nanny paired up and left the husband whose idea the threesome was.
- Says many lawyers refuse to sign his contract clause requiring a parent to help young kids buy a small gift for the co-parent something he 'cannot figure out.'
- Explains why he discourages 'fidelity clauses' and 'sunset clauses' in prenups they create perverse incentives and ugly legal battles over what counts as cheating.
- Publicly apologizes to Gordon Ryan, admitting he behaved obnoxiously toward the young athlete years ago while his mother was dying.
- Floats an unspoken theory: giving divorcing couples controlled psilocybin or MDMA sessions could enable 'transformative divorce work.'
Worth remembering
- As a divorce lawyer he must argue both sides, which convinced him 'the good guy bad guy thing just doesn't apply' to real relationships.
- A lover is legally called a 'paramour,' and money spent on one can be 'wasteful dissipation of marital assets,' recoverable in a divorce.
- About 56% of marriages end in divorce, yet 84% of divorced people remarry within five years people keep betting on love.
- The cheapest divorce he's seen cost about $3,500 (a kitchen-table agreement); the most complex have run two to three million in counsel fees.
- The most expensive prenup he ever drafted cost about $3,000 trivial relative to the assets it protects.
- A real prenup case enforced a clause docking the wife $10,000/month in alimony for every 10 pounds she gained during the marriage.
- His book's line 'if we invented an infidelity-generating machine it would be called Facebook' he'd now update to Instagram, or 'Meta.'
- Kevin Costner's well-crafted prenup actually held up classic 'once bitten twice shy' after his costly first divorce.
- Sexton wakes naturally at 4 a.m., is asleep by 8 p.m., and bills his life in six-minute increments (tenths of an hour).
- He chose his Manhattan apartment based on its walking proximity to Marcelo Garcia's Jiu-Jitsu academy.