The guest
Glenn Loury: Professor of economics and social sciences at Brown University, MIT-trained economist, and host of 'The Glenn Show.' A prominent black conservative voice on race, inequality, and identity politics.
What this episode covers
Glenn Loury joins Lex Fridman for a wide-ranging conversation that opens on Martin Luther King's 'I Have a Dream' speech and the meaning of equality. Loury distinguishes equal opportunity from equal outcomes, arguing that group cultural differences, not just discrimination, drive disparities. He defends a 'black patriotism' rooted in American identity, criticizes the weaponized use of 'racist' as a witch-hunt epithet, and explains the 'spiral of silence' that suppresses honest debate. He lays out why he became a market-oriented conservative who 'hates' affirmative action as a demeaning band-aid. The talk closes intimately on mortality, the deaths of his wife and brother-in-law, and what gives life meaning.
Recommended on this episode
BookRecommendedISBN verified
Slavery and Social Death
Orlando Patterson
“there's a wonderful book”
“there's a wonderful book by the sociologist orlando patterson called slavery and social death that was published in 1982 which is a comprehensive history”— Glenn Loury
BookRecommendedISBN verified
Knowledge and Decisions
Thomas Sowell
“one of tom's books i deeply admire”
“one of tom's books i deeply admire knowledge and decisions is an extension of the haiki and arguments about the limits of central planning”— Glenn Loury
BookRecommendedISBN verified
Invisible Man
Ralph Ellison
“the great ralph ellison ... invisible man is his masterpiece”
“the great ralph ellison the african-american writer invisible man is his masterpiece embodied this spirit”— Glenn Loury
BookRecommendedISBN verified
The Swerve
Stephen Greenblatt
“i read this wonderful book called the swerve”
“i read this wonderful book called the swerve it's about lucretius it's about the nature of things which is this great classical work”— Glenn Loury
Also referenced (named, not recommended)
BookReferenced
The Three-Body Problem
Cixin Liu
“he has a trilogy of the three-body problem the dark forest and death's end those are the three books of chicks and lou's trilogy”— Glenn Loury
BookReferenced
The Dark Forest
Cixin Liu
“he has a trilogy of the three-body problem the dark forest and death's end those are the three books of chicks and lou's trilogy”— Glenn Loury
BookReferenced
Death's End
Cixin Liu
“he has a trilogy of the three-body problem the dark forest and death's end those are the three books of chicks and lou's trilogy”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
Nigger: The Strange Career of a Troublesome Word
Randall Kennedy
“my friend randall kennedy the law professor at harvard university has a book called nigger and he uses the word in the title of the book”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
The Bell Curve
Charles Murray
“charles murray is a popular social science writer who is famous for his book about iq the bell curve one chapter of which chronicles the racial differences”— Glenn Loury
BookReferenced
The Spiral of Silence
Elisabeth Noelle-Neumann
“i once read this book by a german political scientist called elizabeth neula neumann the book was called the spiral of silence and the argument was”— Glenn Loury
BookReferenced
Capital
Karl Marx
“you read marx marx was an important figure in the history of the west and i think mark should be read and capital three volumes etc”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
An American Dilemma
Gunnar Myrdal
“gunnar maridol the swedish economist wrote about economic development wrote a famous two-volume work an american dilemma about the status of blacks”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
A Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man
James Joyce
“i quote james joyce he has a passage in portrait of an artist as a young man in which he says do you know what ireland is”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
Ulysses
James Joyce
“they may not be reading my stuff in a hundred years as people will certainly be reading ulysses in a hundred years”— Glenn Loury
BookReferencedISBN verified
On the Nature of Things (De Rerum Natura)
Lucretius
“lucretius's great work on the nature of things was one of these books ... one of lucretius's points he was an atheist”— Glenn Loury
BookReferenced
As I Lay Dying
Richard John Neuhaus
“there is a book by richard john newhouse the theologian called as i lay dying ... he had stomach cancer and he thought he was dying and he wrote this book”— Glenn Loury
Big reveals from this episode
- Loury opens declaring 'I hate affirmative action... I hate it,' calling it a band-aid that substitutes for developing black competitive capacity.
- Loury says he can use the n-word because he's black and because he loves hip-hop, and defends Joe Rogan as 'not a racist.'
- He compares calling someone a 'racist' to accusing them of witchcraft, a power move rather than an argument.
- Loury describes losing faith in the civil rights movement, saying it became an apologia for black America's failures.
- 'Nobody is coming to save us' and 'the Chinese are coming' frame his demand for mastery over excuses.
- He says of the 2008 Obama campaign, 'I can't believe I bought that crap,' and argues race relations got set back under Obama.
- Loury reveals he is no longer a Christian or a theist, siding with Lucretius that fearing death is irrational.
- He argues Clarence Thomas deserves the same celebration as Obama and is unfairly erased from American education.
Worth remembering
- Orlando Patterson's 'Slavery and Social Death' documents slavery across 2,500 years and many civilizations, not just America.
- Roughly 600,000 died in the Civil War out of a country of 30 million, an immense cost to eradicate slavery.
- Loury notes virtually every black American has European ancestry, a consequence of slavery's mixed population.
- His uncle Mooney admired the Nation of Islam's self-reliance and left Loury a complete LP collection of Malcolm X speeches.
- The 'spiral of silence' explains how widely-held views go unspoken because each holder thinks they're alone.
- The emperor's-new-clothes child matters because he creates 'common knowledge', everyone knowing that everyone else knows.
- Loury uses visual acuity and corrective lenses as an analogy: interventions can level natural cognitive differences.
- He calls Thomas Sowell one of the 100 most significant economists of the 20th century who deserves a Nobel.
- He invokes Joyce's image of turning the 'nets' of ethnic inheritance into 'wings' to fly.
- 'The Swerve' by Stephen Greenblatt tells how Lucretius's lost work was rediscovered in a Renaissance monastery.
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