Ben Fogle: British TV presenter, broadcaster and author who climbed Everest, rowed the Atlantic and trekked across Antarctica; host of the documentary series New Lives in the Wild.
What this episode covers
Ben Fogle tells Stephen Bartlett that his relentless pursuit of slow endurance adventures comes not from being an adrenaline junkie but from rebuilding confidence after a childhood marked by undiagnosed dyslexia, failed exams and deep self-doubt. He argues that society writes our narrative through labels, conformity and a broken education system incentivised by money rather than children's passions. He shares the profound grief of losing his stillborn son Willem, the anxiety and panic attacks that followed, and how annual preventative marriage counselling transformed his relationship with his wife Marina. Drawing on a decade filming people who have dropped off the grid, he champions simplicity, nature and connection as the real sources of happiness over wealth and social-media comparison.
The guest's own work
Inspire: Life Lessons from the Wilderness
Ben Fogle
“i actually read that in on the last page of the first chapter of your book it said the ocean had taught me to take control of my own narrative”— Stephen Bartlett
Also referenced (named, not recommended)
Happy Sexy Millionaire
Stephen Bartlett
“this is actually why my book is called happy sexy millionaire because when i was 18 all i wanted in life was to be a millionaire”— Stephen Bartlett
The Moneyless Man
Mark Boyle
“there's a man called mark boyle who lives in ireland a fascinating man he has lived as the moneyless man and he gave up everything”— Ben Fogle
Lost Connections
Johann Hari
“do you know who that johann hari he wrote called lost connection yes of course yeah he's going to be sat there in two hours”— Ben Fogle
Nokia 3310
Nokia
“i was really happy with my nokia 3310 but in a world of iphones i'm devastated to own a nokia 3310 it's the same phone”— Stephen Bartlett
Big reveals from this episode
- Ben says after 20 years on screen he is still 'a few hundred meters from the summit' of peak confidence and remains burdened by an inner voice of doubt.
- He reveals he and Marina lost their third child, a stillborn son named Willem, three weeks before the due date due to a placental abruption.
- After the loss they began once-a-year preventative marriage counselling, and Ben says he can't remember the last time they argued.
- He describes a year of severe anxiety and panic attacks following the loss, driven by a feeling of having lost control.
- Ben says he has lasted 21 years in TV largely because of the big prime-time shows he turned down, not the ones he accepted.
- He says he is not scared of dying after multiple near-death experiences, only fearful for those he loves.
- He admits taking his driving test eight times and attending five schools and three universities because of his fear of failure.
Worth remembering
- Ben was sent to a French school by his Canadian father to be bilingual, but the rigid system left his English going backwards and he learned no French.
- A head teacher told Stephen schools get roughly 4,000 pounds per student from the government, making grades a business-driven incentive.
- Ben rowed across the Atlantic in a 20-foot boat over 49 days, capsized in 30-foot waves and nearly drowned, calling it his biggest achievement.
- Stephen cites studies showing people pick the middle option among three steaks or TVs because value is judged relative to context.
- Ben recounts the parable of a fisherman who, advised to scale up his business to one day relax and fish, replies that he already fishes.
- In Japan and Sweden people practise 'forest bathing', lying in woods and staring at the canopy to reconnect with nature.
- Stephen claims living in New York makes people far more likely to be depressed than living somewhere like Bali.
- Ben praises New Zealand PM Jacinda Ardern's attempt to measure national success by happiness and kindness indices rather than GDP.