Richard Reeves: Founder of the American Institute for Boys and Men and former Brookings Institution scholar. Author of 'Of Boys and Men,' he researches the challenges facing boys and men through a nonpartisan, data-driven lens.
What this episode covers
Steven Bartlett interviews Richard Reeves about the modern crisis facing boys and men. Reeves argues that the economic liberation of women, a profoundly positive development, has left a question-mark over the male role that society has failed to refill, leaving many men feeling unneeded. The conversation covers male suicide rates, the friendship recession, the collapse of dating prospects for the bottom half of men, declining marriage and fatherhood, and the harm done by the term 'toxic masculinity.' Reeves shares his own struggle, including a pivotal couples-therapy moment when his wife told him his problem was that he wasn't masculine enough. He concludes that the most powerful fix is simply for society to tell struggling men 'we see you' without rolling back progress for women.
The guest's own work
Of Boys and Men: Why the Modern Male Is Struggling, Why It Matters, and What to Do about It
Richard Reeves
“Richard you wrote a book called of boys and men why the modern male is struggling and why it matters and what to do about it”— Richard Reeves
Also referenced (named, not recommended)
Death of a Salesman
Arthur Miller
“that goes back to like Arthur Miller's play Death of a Salesman Willie lman takes his own life because he thinks that the life insurance his family will get”— Richard Reeves
The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe (The Chronicles of Narnia)
C.S. Lewis
“much better known for his work on The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe The Chronicles of nania but he this lovely line”— Richard Reeves
Mean Girls
Mark Waters
“is there such a thing as toxic femininity have you watched Mean Girls uh I can't say I've watched it but I know the movie”— Richard Reeves
Far Cry 5
Ubisoft
“let's go do vegan sushi roll I just want to play Far Cry five I just want to lie on my back and watch Manchester United”— Steven Bartlett
Big reveals from this episode
- Reeves says the hardest thing he's ever done as a man was couples therapy, where his wife told him 'the problem is you're not masculine enough.'
- A man dies by suicide roughly every 13 minutes in the US; 545,000 fewer men would have died since 1999 if their rate matched women's.
- Research found the two words men most used to describe themselves before taking their own lives were 'useless' and 'worthless.'
- The bottom ~50% of men get almost no attention on dating apps while the top 10% get nearly all of it.
- Divorced men face an eight-fold higher suicide risk than divorced women.
- Reeves claims Andrew Tate converted to Islam so he could have multiple wives, consistent with his worldview on gender.
- Reeves calls 'toxic masculinity' a gender slur and says non-toxic masculinity is effectively an empty set.
- 15% of US men under 30 say they have no close friends, up from 3% in 1990, a 'male friendship recession.'
Worth remembering
- There is now a bigger gender gap in higher education than in the 1970s, but reversed in women's favor.
- US college enrollment dropped seven times more for men than women in the immediate aftermath of COVID.
- One study found companies led by women (CEO and CFO) are less likely to go bankrupt but slightly less profitable.
- Anthropologist Anna Machin argues fatherhood was 'invented' because going bipedal forced humans to give birth to vulnerable, early babies needing a provider.
- About 95% of known human societies were polygamous; monogamy is recent and unusual.
- Humans have roughly twice as many female ancestors as male ancestors, because historically only ~50% of men reproduced.
- About 40% of US births now occur outside marriage, up from roughly 10%; 70% of Black children are born outside marriage.
- Women are about twice as likely as men to initiate divorce, what economists call 'exit power.'
- Men open up more easily shoulder-to-shoulder than face-to-face, which is why walking therapy and the 'men's sheds' movement work.
- Only about 1 in 10 primary school teachers are men, depleting real-life male role models for boys.