Gary Stevenson and Daniel Priestley: Gary Stevenson is a former Citibank interest-rates trader turned economist and YouTuber (Gary's Economics), author of bestseller 'The Trading Game'. Daniel Priestley is a serial tech entrepreneur, investor and author of 'Entrepreneur Revolution' who runs a business accelerator.
What this episode covers
Steven Bartlett hosts a heated debate on the state of the UK, US and Western economies, framed around why ordinary people are getting poorer. Gary Stevenson argues the core problem is rising wealth inequality, with assets and housing being squeezed out of the middle class and into the hands of a mobile super-rich, and that the only fix is taxing wealth holders heavily while cutting tax on workers. Daniel Priestley counters that the real driver is shrinking economic freedom, big government, high taxes and the technological disruption that is globalizing and automating traditional jobs, and that the answer is freer markets and entrepreneurship. They spar over the Duke of Westminster's tax, the millionaire exodus to Dubai, the post-war 'golden age', remote work, and whether ordinary kids can realistically get rich. Both agree the middle class is collapsing but fundamentally disagree on cause and cure.
The guest's own work
The Trading Game
Gary Stevenson
“I'd also highly recommend everybody to go check out the trading game because everybody's talking about this this book”— Steven Bartlett
Entrepreneur Revolution
Daniel Priestley
“I highly recommend everybody to go check out Dan priestley's entreprene Revolution but also your website has all of your resources”— Steven Bartlett
Also referenced (named, not recommended)
A Tale of Two Cities
Charles Dickens
“there's a book Charles Dickens wrote called The Tale of Two Cities and the opening line of the book is it was the best of times it was the worst of times”— Daniel Priestley
Hard Times
Charles Dickens
“we talk about Charles Dickens I read hard times I read hard times and this is written in the 19th century when Britain was like the industrial super”— Gary Stevenson
ChatGPT
OpenAI
“so like open AI chat GPT we're all using that Bloody product and pay our 20 $30 a month”— Daniel Priestley
ElevenLabs
ElevenLabs
“who's acing the value there well it's a company in America called 11 labs and it's bloody open Ai”— Steven Bartlett
Big reveals from this episode
- Gary reveals he was Citibank's most profitable trader in the world in 2011, making them just over $35 million by betting Western society would keep deteriorating.
- Daniel claims UK economic freedom fell from 82 to 68 out of 100 since 2006, which he says predictably drives up poverty.
- Gary says he paid 60% top-rate tax to lift his family out of poverty while the Duke of Westminster's trust effectively pays about 0.6% a year.
- An estimated 10,800 millionaires left the UK in 2024 (up 57%), roughly one every 45 minutes, after the non-dom scheme ended.
- Gary's emotional outburst: 'I'm sick of multi-millionaires telling kids who can't afford to turn the heating on you just need to be more entrepreneurial.'
- Steven Bartlett says he doesn't think he should be able to pass his assets to his children and thinks inheritance tax should be higher than 40%.
- Gary states his plan is to get 5 million internet followers and 'bully the politicians' into taxing the rich.
- Gary's blunt forecast: poverty will increase quickly and it will become almost impossible for ordinary people to make serious money.
Worth remembering
- The 'Magnificent 7' US tech companies went from roughly a $5 trillion to $17 trillion valuation during the pandemic.
- In the UK, 9.5 million homes have two or more spare bedrooms, and 78% of housing wealth is held by baby boomers.
- In Q4 2024 the US economy grew 6% versus 0.1% in the UK; US GDP per head is about $82,000 versus $49,000 in the UK.
- Since 2007, American income per head rose 72% while UK income per head fell about 2% in dollar terms.
- In the UK the top 1% of taxpayers pay about 30% of income tax and the top 10% pay about 60%.
- Steven says an AI-generated podcast in his cloned voice, written and published by AI, holds a 4.6-star rating on Apple.
- Singapore's government is only about 25% of GDP yet directs citizens heavily into home ownership via its sovereign wealth fund.
- If the richest families of 1900 had simply kept their wealth, there would be roughly 16,000 more billionaires today, showing wealth rarely persists across generations.
- Daniel cites that around 65% of ultra-high-net-worth individuals globally are self-made, ~19% inherited, and ~16% inherited then grew it.
- The UK has about 11% of working-age people declared too sick to work and roughly one in seven men not working at all.